[12:10pm] bilano: Sorry my keyboard was stucker.
[12:11pm] bilano: So I was blogging about this crazy Intel rumor (it is just a rumor) and how it's going to change life pretty bad if it's true.
[12:11pm] Squire: where are the "live" updates?
[12:12pm] Nibb: I'm on the edge. Of. My. Seat.
[12:12pm] bilano: Frankly I think Steve Jobs is probably just doing the beast with two backs as it were!
[12:12pm] Nibb: This is extraordinary.
[12:12pm] Squire: what the hell is happening?
[12:12pm] Nibb: Dude, Squire, you can't see?
[12:12pm] Squire: nope
[12:12pm] Nibb: Oh. Good, i'm not alone
[12:12pm] j3: # 3800 attendees. largest in last decade. 45 countries including China. 110 lab sessions. 400+ entries for Appple Design Awards. Over half-a-million ADC members. 109 stores. 1 million visitors per week. Retail/Online stores have sold half a billion in products. [10:07 am]
[12:12pm] Squire: i got "biggest keynote in 10 years" then nothing. maybe the whole place just blew up
[12:12pm] j3: # Apple shows retail video. 109 stores. 1 million visitors per week. Retail/Online stores have sold half a billion in products. "Best Buying Experience in the World" [10:07 am]
[12:13pm] j3: End of last quarter 16 million iPods sold. 76% marketshare of all MP3 players. 430M sonds sold and downloaded. 82 percent iTunes marketshare in the month of May. Podcasting is exploding. [10:11 am]
[12:13pm] bilano: Steve is wearing all black like he's some kind of Johnny Cash...
[12:13pm] karmichoa: man I wish there was a video webcast
[12:13pm] Mob1us: me 2
[12:14pm] metrom: he is allways in black though
[12:14pm] bilano: I am there guys I am IRC'ing on my Sidekick!
[12:14pm] dualhead: and a litte denim
[12:14pm] ilya: man, the cult of Steve...
[12:14pm] bilano: It is a cult but it is fun! People need heros!
[12:14pm] Squire: bilano: give us some updates
[12:14pm] j3: Apple will build in Podcasting support into iTunes. Easy/quick listing of Podcasts right into iTunes. [10:13 am]
[12:15pm] ilya: oh, my god! he's just had a cup of coffee! wait, it might've been hot chocolate... we're clarifying the issue
[12:15pm] bilano: Nibb: I am Bill Bilano, expert computer expert.
[12:15pm] Squire: hehe
[12:15pm] bilano: Nibb: http://www.bilano.biz/
[12:15pm] Nibb: Yeah, I'm just amusing myself :P
[12:15pm] j3: http://www.neowin.net/comments.php?id=28771&category=main
[12:15pm] karmichoa: I just want to hear the huge announcement of the thing my friend has worked on for the last 5 years
[12:15pm] karmichoa: some huge project
[12:16pm] Squire: is anyone else following the macrumorslive.com updates?
[12:16pm] karmichoa: I have that open too Squire
[12:16pm] karmichoa: it's slower than here!
[12:16pm] ilya: Squire: yep
[12:16pm] j3: Squire: macrumorslive sucks
[12:16pm] pi^: much slower
[12:16pm] ilya: i'm on their irc
[12:16pm] bilano: Whoa whoa whoa! __16 million ipods__?!
[12:16pm] Squire: all i have on that is that steve is wearing black
[12:16pm] bilano: Someone has got to stop them! Holy crapper!
[12:16pm] bilano: Apple needs to stop selling those because they are selling too many!
[12:17pm] bilano: irc.macrumorslive.com is crap! They wont let anybody talk in there. They are high-horse-minded like Steve Jobs.
[12:17pm] bilano: They think they have a podium because they've primed the pumper!
[12:17pm] ilya: bilano: if all you want is just the updates.... *shrug*
[12:17pm] Nibb: That's a lot of 'p' words, bila
[12:17pm] Nibb: no
[12:17pm] Nibb: bilano
[12:17pm] CoolerQ: bilano, join #macrumorschat on irc.macrumorslive.com to chat
[12:17pm] j3: 10:16 am Apple will build in Podcasting support into iTunes. Easy/quick listing of Podcasts right into iTunes. Subscribe podcasts, download old podcasts. Jobs demos Adam Curry podcast. Artwork in iTunes window changes as you scrub podcasts. Jobs said that new iTunes would take podcasting mainstream.
[12:18pm] bilano: Last I checked we were in AMERICA. :)
[12:18pm] ilya: bilano: "but only for now" :)
[12:18pm] Nibb: Yeah, but isn't IRC sort of non-...denominational? Is that the right word? with regards to nationalism
[12:18pm] bilano: The Internet is an American institution!
[12:19pm] Mob1us: so whats your point
[12:19pm] karmichoa: Okay, someone UPDATE
[12:19pm] Nibb: I mean, it's kinda like teh intarwebs, you can only govern what's inside your borders
[12:19pm] bilano: We brought it on and we can take it away, just like we did in Iraq against those boneheads!
[12:19pm] ilya: i have a feeling we're not in kansas anymore
[12:19pm] karmichoa: shaddup!
[12:19pm] karmichoa: and UPDATE
[12:19pm] Nibb: Yeth, Mithtreth...
[12:19pm] vincentlo: the new version of itunes will be available tonight
[12:19pm] Mob1us: will it have a credit card reader?
[12:20pm] bilano: Okay, so Steve jobs is wearing black and he has a cool new hair style... he's got a kickin' new intro song, they are playing "Eye of the Tiger".
[12:20pm] bilano: And the big OS X "X" came floating down like in Spinal Tap
[12:20pm] vincentlo: quicktime 7 for windows available
[12:20pm] niteshado: OMG I hate that song...
[12:21pm] Nibb: bilano, you're the expert compy expert, right? Can you tell me, in n00b terms, how one would join #macrumorschat on irc.macrumorslive.com? I got the #macrumorschat part, but no clue how to do the irc.macrumorslive.com part
[12:21pm] bilano: Steve is playing air guitar now and they've got a robot Woz powered by Keynote!
[12:21pm] bilano: Oh my god it's just like a Kraftwerk video!
[12:21pm] ilya: Nibb, what's your client
[12:21pm] Mob1us: nibb
[12:21pm] Nibb: mIRC
[12:22pm] Mob1us: ./server -m irc.macrumorslive.com
[12:22pm] bilano: Steve is talking about spotlight or something now... and everybody is booing. I have no idea why!
[12:22pm] Mob1us: will join another server and leave you connected to this one
[12:22pm] vincentlo: sells of apple computer growing 3X bigger than pcs
[12:22pm] Nibb: Holy jebus! Danke!
[12:22pm] Mob1us: np man
[12:22pm] karmichoa: http://live.macobserver.com/article/2005/06/wwdc2005_keynote.shtml
[12:22pm] karmichoa: that's being updated every couple of minutes
[12:23pm] bilano: Things are going to get mighty cold around here since THE WOZ joined Microsoft.
[12:23pm] bilano: OKAY... real update time...
[12:23pm] Mob1us: he did?
[12:23pm] Mob1us: whooa
[12:24pm] bilano: Apple says it delivered 15,000,000 copies of Mac OSX Tiger and has already sold out in less than six weeks of release! 400 new dashboard widgets available since that time it was on the self! Steve is demoing a few of the widgets right now.
[12:25pm] bilano: Steve has said that over a billion copies of Qucktime 7 have been downloaded!
[12:25pm] nathanae1: Interestingly, Steve is showing us Dashboard Widgets. He chose an Amazon one to show us that returned at least one For Dummies book when he searched for Tiger that Steve has banned from his own Apple Stores.
[12:26pm] bilano: Steve just said that OSX 10.5 will be out by years end, the codename is "Lyndie".
[12:26pm] bilano: The next version of iDisk will switch to use BitTorrent!
[12:27pm] bilano: Jobs is now showing of RSS widgets and all of the RSS feeds are talking about Intel and he closed it real fast and giggled a bit at the cameras.
[12:28pm] bilano: Intel CPUS!
[12:28pm] bilano: Steve just said it!
[12:28pm] metrom: bilano, wtf are you talking about
[12:28pm] Mob1us: the question is OSX for intel cpu's, as in made by intel for mac, or using existing x86 architecture
[12:29pm] bilano: Developers will have access to test systems this year, and customers will get them next year.
[12:29pm] bilano: The audience is furious!
[12:29pm] bilano: I am getting out of here!
[12:29pm] strtok: furious about what?
[12:29pm] bilano: I have a hard time hearing there is so much shouting.
[12:29pm] bilano: strtok: I am on my Sidekick at this place watching Jobs give his spe
[12:30pm] strtok: ok
[12:30pm] bilano: Crap I just got hit
[12:30pm] strtok: i missed what happened
[12:30pm] strtok: haha
[12:30pm] ilya: bilano: unless you
[12:30pm] Mob1us: lol
[12:30pm] bilano: Things are getting crazy here.
[12:30pm] bilano: It's like a mosh pit
[12:31pm] bilano: The mood of the crowd is not jovial
[12:31pm] bilano: The mood is downright scary
[12:31pm] bilano: I've moved to the back of the hall
[12:31pm] MuLLvM: yehyeh
[12:31pm] bilano: People are still shoving each other and rustling around
[12:31pm] dizastor: be careful of his surgery scar when you pass him around
[12:32pm] bilano: Steve just said PowerPC to Intel transition will take two years.
[12:32pm] Luc_: What??
[12:32pm] Luc_: Its real then
[12:32pm] bilano: 2007
[12:32pm] bilano: That's what I've been saying! Nobody here is believing me.
[12:32pm] bilano: The crowd is unruly right now.
[12:32pm] Luc_: I just logged in and read you saying this!
[12:32pm] bilano: People were cheering, some were shouting... now it's sort of like a mosh pit.
[12:32pm] nucleuz: every release of OS X has been compiled for Intel x86 for the last 5 years
[12:32pm] Luc_: Is Steve DEAD?
[12:32pm] bilano: No
[12:33pm] Luc_: No fucking way!
[12:33pm] bilano: Steve is still on stage but corp security has surrounded the stage entry.
[12:33pm] Luc_: ok you are kidding!!
[12:33pm] Luc_: right?
[12:33pm] bilano: Luc_: I am there right now man!
[12:33pm] bilano: Luc_: On my little laptop thinger.
[12:33pm] Luc_: you are there at the WWDC?
[12:33pm] MuLLvM: then report for fux sake
[12:33pm] babazoid: anyone that wants to get in on the real channel server: irc.macrumorslive.com --- channel #macrumors
[12:33pm] bilano: Luc_: Yeah, I moved back after the shouting started.
[12:33pm] Mob1us: already there m8
[12:33pm] bilano: Luc_: The atmosphere it tense.
[12:34pm] Luc_: INCREDIBLE!
[12:34pm] Luc_: Thanks SO much for doing this!
[12:34pm] bilano: Okat Steve said there are two transitions...
[12:34pm] bilano: 680x0 -> PowerPC
[12:34pm] bilano: And now is the time for PowerPC -> Intel
[12:35pm] Luc_: Hanging by the throat
[12:35pm] bilano: People are being rounded up... some commotion
[12:36pm] cjackson: the guy updating probably had a stroke
[12:36pm] Luc_: This is SO incredible, it cant be real!
[12:36pm] bilano: I am seeing something that looks like one of those riot gear guns that fire teargas
[12:36pm] Luc_: ok this is a joke then!
[12:36pm] bilano: I was kidding.
[12:36pm] Luc_: about the whole thing?
[12:36pm] bilano: But there is some movement back here
[12:36pm] bilano: Don't know what's going on
[12:36pm] erp2: yep. well that's what's happening on the web live update thing. i'm not getting anything at all on the irc...
[12:36pm] bilano: No, just about the riot gun.
[12:37pm] bilano: But the people ARE unruly.
[12:37pm] karmichoa: that's it??
[12:37pm] Luc_: WHew!
[12:37pm] karmichoa: that was his 5 year project??
[12:37pm] karmichoa: switching a processor??
[12:37pm] bilano: I've heard a lot of people muttering "fuck him", etc. on their way out.
[12:37pm] Luc_: I can imagine that they are half crazy
[12:37pm] karmichoa: he got a 10 grand bonus check for switching a processor??
[12:37pm] bilano: They are storming around, fuming!
[12:37pm] karmichoa: damn
[12:37pm] Mob1us: good, fuck em
[12:37pm] bilano: OMFG... "Intel delivers much better performance"
[12:37pm] bilano: !!!
[12:37pm] Luc_: Did Steve say WHY the switch??
[12:37pm] bilano: They are releasing XCode 2.1
[12:38pm] MuLLvM: i dont care what ppl are doing - i wanna know whats being said
[12:38pm] Luc_: WTF!!!
[12:38pm] bilano: Which will compile a fat binary
[12:38pm] bilano: Luc_: He said better performance all around.
[12:38pm] strtok: a fat binary?
[12:38pm] strtok: wtf is a fat binary?
[12:38pm] Luc_: But thats impossible , all these years of saying the opposite!
[12:38pm] bryce__: have they given any technical info about how the transition will take place? PPC emulation, etc?
[12:38pm] bilano: strtok: Yeah, x86 and PPC in one binary.
[12:38pm] Mob1us: i bet motorola doesn't want to be in the cpu game, ot they want to expand on the cpu enterprise
[12:38pm] dorip: that's like when the ingredients list on artificial fruit juice says "natural flavors"
[12:38pm] strtok: oh
[12:38pm] dorip: thanks for being specific
[12:39pm] bilano: Steve is saying that existing Cocoa software can be easily ported
[12:39pm] Luc_: yea ported BUT we have to PAY all over again for appz!
[12:39pm] bilano: Widgets, scripts, java work already, cocoa needs porting... carbon needs tweaking or something... a few weeks out? I dunno.
[12:39pm] bilano: I can't keep up people are pissed off.
[12:39pm] bilano: There's no more cheering.
[12:39pm] dorip: they're switching to x86?
[12:40pm] bilano: Just shouting, hissing, and heckling
[12:40pm] Luc_: no wonder there wasnt a simulcast!
[12:40pm] Mob1us: hahaha
[12:40pm] bilano: dorip: Yep!
[12:40pm] Mob1us: ZEALOTS
[12:40pm] bilano: dorip: It is official!
[12:40pm] dorip: huh!
[12:40pm] bilano: Okay
[12:40pm] Luc_: I am shocked, its the SHOCK of my life@
[12:40pm] bilano: Xcode 2.1 will be available to everybody who attended the keynote... it will make fat binaries.
[12:40pm] Mob1us: kind like when apple dropped DOS 2.1, i was shocked
[12:40pm] bilano: So we can do it right now apparently.
[12:41pm] dorip: well
[12:41pm] bilano: Steve has asked people not to warez it.
[12:41pm] bilano: I heard someone next to me say "Yeah right! Traitorous a**hole"
[12:41pm] karmichoa: what's Xcode?
[12:41pm] Luc_: INcredible, Steve is in big trouble!
[12:41pm] Luc_: warez what?
[12:41pm] dorip: considering that they just released all these new power mac g5s recently, 2.7ghz, etc. etc etc
[12:41pm] chrissaub: que pasa??
[12:41pm] bryce__: heh, Steve will be proved right because this means better, cheaper macs
[12:41pm] bilano: I don't know how they are going to get him out of here... the temperature in the conference hall has risen like 10 degrees in the last 20 minutes.
[12:41pm] bryce__: although the transition will be ugly
[12:41pm] bilano: bryce__: No, it means more money for Apple.
[12:42pm] beeb87: bryce__: intel cpus are more expensive
[12:42pm] dorip: especially if they keep the same prices
[12:42pm] bryce__: beeb87: nope, not if you're apple. Intel made them a deal they couldn't refuse.
[12:42pm] Luc_: Apple always charges more and will hav eto make up for lost users
[12:42pm] beeb87: bryce__: source?
[12:42pm] bilano: It makes me wonder about why AMD was left out.
[12:42pm] bilano: AMD makes superior chips all around.
[12:42pm] cjackson: amd blows
[12:42pm] dorip: well, as such, I should be glad that my last mac is still a yosemite g3-400
[12:42pm] Luc_: YEa they do!
[12:42pm] bilano: Intel is so far behind the times.
[12:43pm] beeb87: bilano: agreed
[12:43pm] bryce__: beeb87: this is speculation, but its no secret that Intel give huge discounts to their best customers, ie Dell
[12:43pm] bilano: But we don't know if it's x86 year.
[12:43pm] dizastor: amd was probably left out because they don't have the ability to supply
[12:43pm] bilano: yet.
[12:43pm] beeb87: bryce__: apple is a tiny customer for them
[12:43pm] karmichoa: okay, I'm seriously confused as to wtf my friend needed a patent for
[12:43pm] ceri: What about 64bit?
[12:43pm] beeb87: much smaller than dell or hp
[12:43pm] bilano: But back to business here...
[12:43pm] karmichoa: they just switched processors
[12:43pm] bilano: Steve has still not said anything about x86
[12:43pm] dorip: apple will probably become a Larger customer now that they're using x86 and will appeal to the mainstream
[12:43pm] Luc_: IS Steve dead yet?
[12:43pm] karmichoa: what exactly would he have developed over the last 5 years that required a patent??
[12:43pm] bilano: It could be Itanium!
[12:43pm] bilano: Or an Intel-built PPC.
[12:43pm] bryce__: beeb87: but having a non-PC manufacturer switch to Intel is awesome PR, I bet they were willing to give a very good deal
[12:44pm] beeb87: bilano: consumer itanium, that would be awesome
[12:44pm] bilano: beeb87: It would be shit!
[12:44pm] bryce__: itanium is crap
[12:44pm] ceri: amd64 > itanium
[12:44pm] Luc_: so he hasnt said x86 for sure yet?
[12:44pm] bilano: Anyway... somebody here said that Steve is screwing the beast with two backs!
[12:44pm] beeb87: bryce__: apple isn't a non-PC manufacturer anymore, they're just another crappy clone-maker. unless bilano's claims are true
[12:44pm] Mob1us: i could care less if it powered by a hamster, as long as it don't crash
[12:44pm] bilano: Luc_: Intel for sure... and that probably DOES mean x86
[12:44pm] bryce__: beeb87: no, Intel-based macs will be nothing like PCs
[12:44pm] bryce__: except for the CPU that is :)
[12:44pm] bilano: OMFG.. corporate security are escorting a few people out right now
[12:45pm] bilano: Hahaha
[12:45pm] bilano: Steve just said it!
[12:45pm] dorip: except for the fact that they will be using the same instruction set as PCs, and therefore eliminating the line between them gradually?
[12:45pm] bilano: x86!!!
[12:45pm] Luc_: This is so freaky! and weird and hellish,,,
[12:45pm] dizastor: screwing the beast with two backs? does that mean he's having sex with a couple who's already having sex?
[12:45pm] bilano: "The demos you've seen for the last half hour have been powered by a Pentium 4"
[12:45pm] Mob1us: thank you bilano
[12:45pm] beeb87: god no
[12:45pm] bilano: Serious!
[12:45pm] Luc_: GROSS!
[12:45pm] blind911: AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAACK
[12:45pm] dorip: so
[12:46pm] beeb87: bryce__: a PC is a PC. that's like saying "an alienware system running linux will be nothing like a PC"
[12:46pm] Luc_: That is EVIL to say!@
[12:46pm] bryce__: 95% of apples market don't give a shit what CPU is inside. the advantage of Macs is about good software, great hardware, and clean hardware/software integration
[12:46pm] dorip: I wonder who's willing to pay to have steve shot right on stage
[12:46pm] beeb87: bryce__: and they got rid of good hardware
[12:46pm] Mob1us: bill gates?
[12:46pm] bilano: When Steve said that shit hit the fan!
[12:46pm] beeb87: and IMHO their software sucks
[12:46pm] bilano: I am getting out of here soon... this is like watching Iraq get bombed.
[12:46pm] Luc_: wow!
[12:46pm] bilano: Jesus people are pissed off here
[12:46pm] Mob1us: haha, thanks bilano
[12:46pm] Luc_: Rightfully so!
[12:46pm] dorip: but everything that is x86 compatible, software-wise, would also be usable on PCs
[12:47pm] Mob1us: can't we all just get together in peace and harmnony
[12:47pm] dorip: therefore everything for mac would be ported to PC and end up a universally compatible app
[12:47pm] cjackson: how are they going to handle 64 bit?
[12:47pm] dorip: well, as far as..pcs are concerned
[12:47pm] dorip: becasue pcs will be able to use OS X, or rather Can
[12:47pm] bilano: cjackson: by using Intel's shitty EMT64.
[12:47pm] dorip: and the apps probably will run in windows.
[12:47pm] bilano: cjackson: Instead of AMD Opterons.
[12:47pm] bryce__: EMT64 == amd64. its the same thing with a different name.
[12:47pm] bilano: bryce__: Yeah, never said it wasn't that way.
[12:48pm] bilano: bryce__: EMT64 is shitty because it's Intel.
[12:48pm] Luc_: All my software investment GONE! jesus!
[12:48pm] bilano: bryce__: Or rather, Intel is shitty because they don't know how to make decent products.
[12:48pm] Luc_: Your a brave man, Bilano, thanks for your help and information!
[12:48pm] bilano: Okay
[12:48pm] bryce__: Luc_: this is the one thing that worries me. will there be an emulation layer?
[12:48pm] bilano: Here is big news
[12:48pm] bigbambu: emy crap?
[12:48pm] bilano: Rosette
[12:48pm] bigbambu: emu
[12:48pm] bilano: Rosetta
[12:48pm] bilano: A "dynamic binary translator"
[12:48pm] bilano: "Runs PPC code on Intel-based Macs"
[12:49pm] bilano: "transparent to users"
[12:49pm] strtok: bryce__: no, apple have had OS X running on intel for years
[12:49pm] strtok: :P
[12:49pm] Luc_: maybe emulation.. but that is always SLOW!
[12:49pm] strtok: codename Marklar
[12:49pm] bilano: Jobs is demoing it right now on his Pe3ntium 4 Mac
[12:49pm] bilano: He's showing Photoshop CS2
[12:49pm] sciflyer: have him try quarkXPress :)
[12:49pm] bryce__: strtok: yes, OS X runs on Intel for years, but what about all the old PPC compiled apps around there
[12:49pm] bilano: with all the plugins that are translated to run on Intel-based Macs
[12:49pm] bilano: BiG NEWS
[12:49pm] bilano: New Development kit
[12:49pm] bryce__: nice
[12:49pm] bilano: 3.6Ghz P4
[12:49pm] arete left the chat room.
[12:49pm] bilano: OSX 10.4.1 for Intel
[12:49pm] zasjoh joined the chat room.
[12:49pm] bilano: Order today
[12:49pm] bilano: Available in TWO WEEKS
[12:50pm] bilano: According to Steve just now
[12:50pm] Mob1us: holy fuckin hell
[12:50pm] sciflyer: um, no
[12:50pm] bilano: 10.4.1 is "preview release"
[12:50pm] bilano: The developer kit is $999
[12:50pm] SCaNDaLs: will this run on "any" pc?
[12:50pm] bilano: That's confirmed
[12:50pm] bilano: SCaNDaLs: Bet your ass it wont.
[12:50pm] SCaNDaLs: good
[12:50pm] bilano: People are laughing at Steve!
[12:50pm] bryce__: SCaNDaLs: no, Mac OS will only ever run on Macs
[12:50pm] zasjoh: really?
[12:51pm] bilano: Someone yelled out "Get it off of BitTorrent!"
[12:51pm] dorip: say hello to virus-filled macs
[12:51pm] dorip: virus/spyware/adware
[12:51pm] bilano: dorip: The virus/spyware is because of Windows.
[12:51pm] karmichoa: That must be my friend's project
[12:51pm] karmichoa: Rosetta
[12:51pm] dorip: it's also due to more interest in pcs
[12:51pm] karmichoa: he said I would like the name
[12:51pm] bilano: dorip: Not because of Intel. Jesus.
[12:51pm] bilano: dorip: Has NOTHING to do with hardware.
[12:51pm] BEjfnjd: Hm
[12:51pm] dorip: instruction set?
[12:51pm] zasjoh: dorip: and we all know that bsd should be secure enough to keep macs sspyware free for a long time, and keep up with keeping them off
[12:51pm] bilano: dorip: Operating system.
[12:52pm] dorip: easier to Make adware/spyware
[12:52pm] bilano: Oh please.
[12:52pm] dorip: more interest in doing so.
[12:52pm] cwoodfiel: dorip: notice that linux and freebad don't have security problems
[12:52pm] bilano: Has nothing to do with Intel.
[12:52pm] cwoodfiel: freebsd, even
[12:52pm] bilano: Don't be a fanboy.
[12:52pm] sciflyer: freebad? aha
[12:52pm] cjackson: or OBSD
[12:52pm] zasjoh: hahaha, whoops
[12:52pm] bilano: Steve justy said to combat security problems
[12:52pm] bilano: The next v ersion of OSX will have random PIDS
[12:52pm] bilano: PIDs
[12:52pm] dorip: half the reason there wasn't such a major issue with holes was because the mac population was 1/50th of the windows users
[12:52pm] zasjoh: although, aren't there some security issues with x86 in general?
[12:53pm] bilano: Ignore dorip, he knows not what he bleats.
[12:53pm] beeb87: bryce__: EMT64 != amd64, it lacks NX etc and it runs slower in 64bit mode
[12:53pm] bilano: Okay, the audience has simmered down a bit...
[12:53pm] ceri: They must have taken PID randomisation out. FreeBSD has had that for a long time.
[12:53pm] cjackson: dorip: explain why Apache doesn't have similar exploits/problems when it owns the webserver market?
[12:53pm] dorip: so. Since mac os x now works on intel processors, what reason would windows not be made for mac then
[12:53pm] cjackson: ?
[12:53pm] cwoodfiel: whois dorip
[12:53pm] Mob1us: none afaik
[12:53pm] cjackson: wth does that mean
[12:53pm] dorip: is apache an operating system?
[12:54pm] Mob1us: no, it's a webserver
[12:54pm] zPeko: Nobody wants it!
[12:54pm] dorip: ok then.
[12:54pm] bryce__: beeb87: it isn't slower. The scheduling parameters are a little different for emt64 vs amd64, code that was optimized for amd64 does run a bit slower yes
[12:54pm] dorip: I fail to see what fine line still exists between mac and pc now
[12:55pm] bilano: Oh god
[12:55pm] bilano: I just ran outside
[12:55pm] dorip: what's different about the intel processors in a mac vs the ones in a pc?
[12:55pm] bilano: People are burning their iPods
[12:55pm] dizastor: so essentially, there will be no mac in the true sense anymore... just a pc with osx
[12:55pm] bilano: These f'ing clowns are burning their ipods outside in the parking lot!
[12:55pm] dorip: that's what it sounds like to me
[12:55pm] sciflyer: ahaha
[12:55pm] dorip: diz.
[12:55pm] beeb87: dorip: well a MacOS x86 system could still get an x86 boot-sector virus, but yeah it's mostly and OS issue
[12:56pm] bryce__: beeb87: unlikely. x86 Macs will still be openfirmware based, they will not use PC-style BIOSes, thus boot sector viruses wont work
[12:56pm] bilano: Intel's CEO is about to take the stage!
[12:56pm] dorip: however the OS might attract more interest (by x86 compatibility in the future?), and from different sectors of the population as a secondary result; undesirable sectors?
[12:56pm] ceri: bryce__: do you *know*, or are you assuming?
[12:56pm] zasjoh: since i came in late, does anyone know where i can get the history of the livestream?
[12:56pm] Luc_: Are you saying that Steve was using a PC? and wants us to but OSX for INTEL now? after JUST buying TIGER>? ?? NO FUCKING WAY!
[12:57pm] xdude: if Apple incorporates Intel processsors into its product line, will my Viagra still work?
[12:57pm] bilano: Shared tooklit for the new platform... they are calling it Yellowbox
[12:57pm] dorip: and especially if you just bought a 2.7ghz dual g5
[12:57pm] dorip: happy day!
[12:57pm] Luc_: I think that this could be the END of APPLE
[12:57pm] cjackson: not like your mac will stop working tomorrow
[12:57pm] bilano: Apple blew it when they went to Intel... they should have gone to AMD.
[12:57pm] BEjfnjd: Nope
[12:57pm] dorip: if they start shipping intel macs in 2006
[12:58pm] beeb87: zasjoh: there are security issues with x86, AMD has fixed them mostly but Intel hasn't
[12:58pm] dorip: then what exactly is the point of anyone buying another mac until then?
[12:58pm] Luc_: Who can trust steve now? not me!
[12:58pm] zasjoh: beeb87: thanks... was curious about that
[12:58pm] bilano: People are burning their iPods outside, still.
[12:58pm] dorip: they know their product is about to become obsolete?
[12:58pm] bilano: There's an iPod burn.
[12:58pm] bilano: The porters have put it out, though.
[12:58pm] beeb87: zasjoh: but good software can work around them anyway
[12:58pm] Ratkail: [19:58] People are burning their iPods outside, still.
[12:58pm] Ratkail: [19:58] they know their product is about to become obsolete?
[12:58pm] Ratkail: [19:58] There's an iPod burn.
[12:58pm] Ratkail: [19:58] The porters have put it out, though.
[12:58pm] ceri: dorip: You have to wonder. , I was waiting for today to buy an iMac. Won't bother now.
[12:58pm] cjackson: not going to be obsolete
[12:58pm] cjackson: geez
[12:58pm] Ratkail: damn sorry
[12:58pm] dorip: how does it smell?
[12:58pm] cjackson: people will compile for both platforms
[12:58pm] zasjoh: bebb87: of course, i'd expect....
[12:58pm] bilano: dorip: I just saw it out the window.
[12:58pm] MuLLvM: trust - lol - like u ask urself that when u buy a computer haha
[12:59pm] dorip: ohh.
[12:59pm] dorip: thought you said you went outside
[12:59pm] bilano: Someone just ran by saying there's an incident in the women's restroom down the way.
[12:59pm] xdude: lol@dorip
[12:59pm] zasjoh: beeb87: i had just heard... just a concern i had, since i had heard about that (although awhile ago, and i'm not a security guy)
[12:59pm] bilano: Security is on the way.
[12:59pm] dorip: well
[12:59pm] beeb87: ipods are flammable?
[12:59pm] xdude: anyone jumping out windows yet? (no pun intended_
[12:59pm] bilano: Jobs is sweating like mad!
[12:59pm] dorip: I bet that incident is apple's fault, really ._. I wonder how much they should get sued for
[12:59pm] Luc_: they are if you use a blowtorch
[12:59pm] bilano: He's up there and he's sweating like a pig!
[12:59pm] bryce__: bilano: I want photos :)
[1:00pm] bilano: His shirt is visibly wet.
[1:00pm] dorip: he's sweating?
[1:00pm] xdude: lol@bryce
[1:00pm] bilano: dorip: In front of this angry mob, I would be too.
[1:00pm] dorip: he should've taken a pill for that beforehand!
[1:00pm] Luc_: really sweating, i wonder will we ever see a QT of this event?
[1:00pm] bilano: He's nervous as hell.
[1:00pm] bilano: PAramedics just ran by!
[1:00pm] dorip: now why would he be nervous if he knew this was going to happen?
[1:00pm] bilano: Heading towards the women restroom!
[1:00pm] dorip: how fun
[1:00pm] beeb87: somebody should throw some fruit at him
[1:00pm] SCaNDaLs: bilano: are you being serious
[1:00pm] bilano: SCaNDaLs: I am there man
[1:00pm] dorip: I wish I could be there to see this chaotic scenario.
[1:01pm] SCaNDaLs: yeah but are you being serious
[1:01pm] Luc_: I wish I was there!!!!
[1:01pm] dorip: it's truly the event of a mac user's lifetime?
[1:01pm] bilano: I just heard some guy on his two-way say someone broke the mirror in the ladies room
[1:01pm] BEjfnjd: When it can run on Intel's why cant they run on AMD
[1:01pm] cjackson: probably can
[1:01pm] slyrus: people are losing it over there?
[1:01pm] Gyron: hi guys
[1:01pm] cjackson: Intel just paid more $$
[1:01pm] dizastor: who? the one female developer? arrest her!
[1:01pm] xdude: a true act of resistance would be to burn code, not iPods
[1:01pm] bilano: Jobs is really waffling around up there.
[1:02pm] dorip: oh is that all?
[1:02pm] bilano: He did not expect it.
[1:02pm] beeb87: dizastor: if somebody's breaking a mirror they won't take much notice of which restroom they do it in
[1:02pm] bilano: The booing continu...
[1:02pm] bilano: HOLY SHIT
[1:02pm] zasjoh: xdude: but code burning is a lot tougher
[1:02pm] dorip: broken mirror calls for paramedics?
[1:02pm] Gyron: Stupid n00b question, but I'm looking for a live IRC feed for the WWDC.
[1:02pm] karmichoa: I am so very happy and excited for my friend
[1:02pm] bilano: The woman in the restroom cut her wtist!!!
[1:02pm] dorip: ahhh
[1:02pm] dorip: there.
[1:02pm] dorip: that's the use of the glass
[1:02pm] karmichoa: Rosetta has to be his project
[1:02pm] bilano: SHE CUT HER WRISTS
[1:02pm] karmichoa: just text messaged him
[1:02pm] karmichoa: holy crap
[1:02pm] dorip: she MUSTVE BEEN A LONG TIME MAC FAN
[1:02pm] karmichoa: he's so wonderfully brilliant
[1:02pm] bitrot: kewl apple suicide girls
[1:02pm] xdude: lol@dizastor
[1:02pm] Mob1us: will there be an OSX for Pocket PC's?
[1:02pm] bilano: It apparently was not a woman!
[1:02pm] bilano: It was a guy!
[1:03pm] annern: any pictures of this?
[1:03pm] dorip: honestly
[1:03pm] dorip: Apple isn't worth it
[1:03pm] dorip: especially now
[1:03pm] dorip: apple isn't worth anything now.
[1:03pm] bilano: No it was a chick
[1:03pm] annern: burning iPods, that is
[1:03pm] dizastor: well it is san fransisco bilano, a man in the ladies room isn't odd
[1:03pm] dorip: maybe she just ordered 20 power mac g5s
[1:03pm] MuLLvM: a tranny maybe
[1:03pm] beeb87: burn ibooks or something, ipods are still good
[1:03pm] dorip: indeed
[1:03pm] Luc_: My mouth is wide open in shock!
[1:03pm] dorip: mac minis
[1:04pm] chrissaub: haha must be a tranny
[1:04pm] bilano: Some guy just rtied to storm the stage!!!
[1:04pm] dorip: that's the economical pyre
[1:04pm] chrissaub: i can't believe what i read here
[1:04pm] chrissaub: must be kiddingme
[1:04pm] bilano: He ran up and tried to tackle the corp security guy
[1:04pm] beeb87: dorip: metal case, doesn't burn as well as acryllic i guess
[1:05pm] bilano: Intel's C/C++ compiler is replacing GCC
[1:05pm] chrissaub: haha i shit my pants
[1:05pm] chrissaub: too funny
[1:05pm] bilano: That's a bad move, IMO.
[1:05pm] dorip: but it's not a live feed, technically.
[1:05pm] dorip: you're the "link"
[1:05pm] bilano: Okay it's over.. Steve is still on stage trying to decide which way to exit
[1:05pm] dorip: and you're only a human.
[1:06pm] Mob1us: hooray for humans
[1:06pm] Gyron: oh - ok then well .. keep it coming guys
[1:06pm] bilano: He ended the speech by just saying "Bye!" and started walking towards the exit point
[1:06pm] dizastor: bilano is our best source, and he's clinically insane
[1:06pm] bilano: Corp security is surrounding him
[1:06pm] Gyron: is someone sitting at the WWDC now?
[1:06pm] bilano: Gyron: I AM!
[1:06pm] bilano: Corp security is escorting him off the stage
[1:06pm] IvIoyner: hehe, someone is having fun
[1:06pm] xdude: lol
[1:06pm] bilano: people are trying to charge him
[1:06pm] Gyron: bilano... sorry, I'm blind... :-)
[1:06pm] Luc_: This was the BEST coverage , you should work for CNN!
[1:06pm] annern: are you serious?
[1:06pm] niteshado: corp security ? they have arrested him? :)
[1:06pm] bilano: Securi... OMFG they are hitting people!
[1:07pm] Mob1us: that's it
[1:07pm] xdude: lmao
[1:07pm] bilano: They are pushing them away!
[1:07pm] Mob1us: they are done
[1:07pm] karmichoa: okay, it's over
[1:07pm] karmichoa: wow
[1:07pm] xdude: too f*ing funny
[1:07pm] SCaNDaLs: i cant believe it
[1:07pm] Mob1us: this is a computing coup de tat
[1:07pm] dorip: it was a coup
[1:07pm] dizastor: Apple should make some new switch ads with Steve as the switcher
[1:07pm] bilano: Steve is hugn up now
[1:07pm] dorip: he just turned his back on his zealots who supported him all this time
[1:07pm] bilano: In the middle of the hall
[1:07pm] bilano: Don't know what's going on
[1:08pm] bilano: oh shit smoke!
[1:08pm] Mob1us: lol
[1:08pm] bilano: Tear gas
[1:08pm] annern: haha
[1:08pm] bilano: Steve's entourage is moving quickly
[1:08pm] bilano: I am getting out iof here one sec
[1:08pm] bilano: chri
[1:08pm] bilano: ddddddd
[1:08pm] dizastor: see if you can raise bilano's bandwidth bill http://www.bilano.biz/
[1:08pm] bilano: ddddddddddd
[1:08pm] sciflyer: this guy is great
[1:08pm] NeverTheL: dude..you gotta know your limit
[1:08pm] Gyron: you think steve's gonna announce a new ibook?
[1:09pm] xdude: lmao Gyron
[1:09pm] Mob1us: the iBook-m ?
[1:09pm] bilano: ok out fornt now
[1:09pm] bilano: they getting steve in the limo
[1:09pm] Luc_: Apple is dead , why even have a WWDC?
[1:09pm] bilano: he ignored pile of burnign ipods out front
[1:09pm] xdude: is the acrid smell of burning iPods still in the air bilano?
[1:09pm] bilano: taking him to a cnbc interview
[1:10pm] bilano: corp security is moving people back into the ubiuilding
[1:10pm] bilano: they are coming my way
[1:10pm] bilano: brb
[1:10pm] bilano: okay they past me
[1:10pm] bilano: people are chasing the car
[1:10pm] bilano: some people rae chasing it screaming at it
[1:10pm] sciflyer: i wonder if they had a meeting about security where they seriously talked about this shit
[1:10pm] SCaNDaLs: what are they saying
[1:10pm] sciflyer: "the people could riot, we're going to need helicopters"
[1:10pm] bilano: just screaming I cant make it out
[1:11pm] bilano: something about "piss on your ibook"
[1:11pm] xdude: lol
[1:11pm] bilano: some peeps from ms are here?!?
[1:11pm] bilano: MS
[1:11pm] bilano: mcirosoft
[1:11pm] dadyd: bilano: Where are you, and how are you on IRC if you see all this?
[1:11pm] bilano: dadyd iam at wwdc
[1:11pm] bilano: the ms people arel aughing about something
[1:11pm] dadyd: Whats WWDC? :D
[1:12pm] bilano: moving back into the building now
[1:12pm] dadyd: In dreams you mean? :D
[1:12pm] bryce__: bilano is a funny guy
[1:12pm] bilano: that chick who cut her wrists at wwdc is okay
[1:12pm] bilano: they got her heading to the ambulance now
[1:13pm] dorip1: huk.
[1:13pm] bilano: they are patting people down as they exit the building
[1:13pm] bilano: dhs is here
[1:13pm] bilano: deparmtne of homeland security
[1:13pm] bilano: they are looking for osmething>?
[1:14pm] karmichoa: do you see a 5'7" fella with dark hair?
[1:14pm] karmichoa: kinda muscular??
[1:14pm] karmichoa: but pasty white?
[1:14pm] bitrot: im glad i live in a free country without DHS
[1:14pm] karmichoa: wow, that's a very ignorant statement
[1:14pm] bitrot: wtf is DHS there.
[1:14pm] karmichoa: but hey, some people are happy being that stupid
[1:14pm] bilano: dhs is looking around here
[1:14pm] bitrot: thanks.
[1:15pm] bilano: they are patting people down still
[1:15pm] bitrot: nice to see good squad is around.
[1:15pm] xdude: someone stole Steve's iBook?
[1:15pm] bilano: okay so that's over with ... the world has changed
[1:15pm] dizastor: It was a dark day in San Francisco, moshing developers, burning ipods, and suicidal transvestites in the ladies room. After the smoke and tear gas cleared, and Steve Jobs was escorted to the private jet that awaited him in the parking lot of the Moscone Center, there was a new mac in town. Only one reporter was brave enough to be on the front lines, only one reporter man enough to take on the ravenous crowd and live to tell the tale. That man was Bill Bil
[1:15pm] bilano: I guess I can use proper spelling and such now that I am sitting again.
[1:16pm] bilano: Transvestite?
[1:16pm] bilano: It was a woman.
[1:16pm] bilano: Someone thought it was a guy but it turned out to be a woman.
[1:16pm] dizastor: must have been pretty
[1:16pm] bilano: For those that do not believe this... http://www.apple.com/pr/library/2005/jun/06intel.html
[1:17pm] bilano: Apple has the official press release up.
[1:17pm] bitrot: diz thats about it
[1:17pm] dorip: I wonder if someone's going to maliciously hack apple's server now
[1:17pm] slyrus: i belive that bit, it's the tear gas and the attempted suicide that is harder to swallow
[1:17pm] Mob1us: the biggest bomb dropped on June 6th since D-Day
[1:17pm] ceri: So any hints on whether 10.5 will run on ppc? 10.6?
[1:18pm] Mob1us: all version of OSX do
[1:18pm] bilano: Okay so now what?
[1:18pm] Mob1us: they just haven't given it to us
[1:18pm] chrissaub: esto esta grande muy grande hombre
[1:18pm] bilano: I am just sitting here.
[1:18pm] bilano: People are leaving WWDC.
[1:18pm] slyrus: 10.5-transitional-transitional?
[1:18pm] bitrot: must have been exciting.
[1:18pm] bilano: People are very listless now.
[1:18pm] bilano: All of them are kind of down.
[1:19pm] Mob1us: they should be listening to "eye of the tiger" on there ipods for inspiration
[1:19pm] bitrot: well when you take one up the ass with jiffylube you walk funny for a bit.
[1:19pm] bilano: Remember that scene from Matrix Revolutions after the battle and there was all that smoke collecting atop the city dome? That's what it's like here.
[1:19pm] bitrot: im just waiting for cnbc interview
[1:19pm] bitrot: watching cnbc now.
[1:19pm] Mob1us: wow
[1:19pm] bilano: bitrot: He made that trip fast...
[1:19pm] bilano: People are really gloomy now.
[1:20pm] dizastor: later guys
[1:20pm] bitrot: hes not on yet
[1:20pm] bitrot: im waiting
[1:20pm] ceri: He didn't mention it?
[1:20pm] bilano: I don't feel safe using this WinCE-based device...
[1:20pm] Mob1us: so by 6-6-6, we will have intel macs
[1:20pm] bilano: Hahaha
[1:20pm] bilano: This is crazy
[1:20pm] bilano: People are so upset!
[1:20pm] bitrot: heh in the end i dont care as long was it works.
[1:20pm] bitrot: at least i might get a fast craptop with a decent stable os
[1:20pm] bitrot: yeah. guess steve was sweating for a reason
[1:20pm] bilano: People are acting like they just attended a bukkake party and decided they didn't really like it after the fact.
[1:21pm] Mob1us: buwhahaha
[1:21pm] bitrot: kewl. they forgot the condoms, lube, and ropes,
[1:21pm] ceri: eew.
[1:21pm] bitrot: appl stock is up
[1:21pm] bilano: Quick joke... What do Michael Jackson and caviar have in common?
[1:21pm] bilano: They both come on little crackers!
[1:22pm] niteshado: moblus : hahah
[1:22pm] bitrot: more updates please
[1:23pm] ceri: Guess it solves the problem of whether to wait for a g5 powerbook or not.
[1:23pm] Mob1us: ah fuck me
[1:23pm] Mob1us: i don't have quicktime installed
[1:25pm] bilano: Okay
[1:25pm] bilano: http://www.bilano.biz/ <-- my bloglog
[1:25pm] bilano: It's a too-good site for you computer experts out there.
[1:25pm] bilano: SOmeone said Apple is suing CNet
[1:25pm] bilano: Because they broke the story on Friday
[1:25pm] bilano: What difference does it make now?
[1:26pm] bilano: We should call the SEC, you know there was insider trading going on.
[1:26pm] niteshado: probably a good thing that the rumours got out early....
[1:27pm] bilano: I am sitting here outside the hall watching people walk by.
[1:27pm] bilano: I've asked a few what they think.
[1:27pm] niteshado: I wish they had been a few weeks earlier - when I ordered my PPC mac!
[1:27pm] bilano: Nobody is pleased.
[1:27pm] bilano: In fact, they seem downright revolted.
[1:27pm] niteshado: why? if the stuff works better than PPCs.... especially in the future - that's a good thing isn't it?
[1:28pm] spooty: exit
[1:28pm] beeb87: niteshado: but intel CPUs aren't better.
[1:28pm] bilano: One gentleman told me he has "nowhere to go now", and that he looks forward to "spyware on the Mac"... when I told him that was Windows not Intel, he said "What's the damn difference?" and stormed off.
[1:28pm] bilano: beeb87: Actually, they are... and AMD's chips are better still.
[1:29pm] bilano: The main conference room is virtually empty.
[1:29pm] bilano: There are overturned chairs...
[1:29pm] sciflyer: what really gets me about this is that the management in my company will not understand at all
[1:29pm] bitrot: its up now
[1:29pm] bitrot: http://www.apple.com/quicktime/qtv/mwsf05/
[1:29pm] bitrot: im watching it now
[1:30pm] beeb87: bilano: powerpc is a superior processor to 32bit x86
[1:30pm] sciflyer: they will use this as an excuse to move publishing to windows
[1:30pm] beeb87: and intel doesn't have any consumer 64bit systems yet
[1:30pm] niteshado: beeb: they may be in the future - intel may be increasing in speed whereas PPC might still have no plan - that's what this is probably all about
[1:30pm] bitrot: unf. yes it is. but ibm wont lisc. P6 to apply. so where do they go.
[1:30pm] beeb87: niteshado: ppc has a plan, microsoft and sony will make sure of that
[1:31pm] niteshado: beeb: yeah - but not a plan that necessarily suits computers (e.g. low power for laptops)
[1:32pm] gordosupe: are they going to stream WWDC?
[1:32pm] SCaNDaLs: who knows what intel will have in 1 yr
[1:32pm] beeb87: niteshado: well consoles can't have very high power, there's no room for watercooling or anything and noise is an issue
[1:32pm] bilano: If you are watching the video, wait until you see the guy try to charge the stage.
[1:33pm] beeb87: SCaNDaLs: who knows what IBM will have in one year
[1:33pm] gordosupe: right, ive been wating they have not done anything to their site
[1:33pm] dorip: Pentium M in the powerbook
[1:33pm] gordosupe: no update to apple.com or events
[1:33pm] dorip: might be nice
[1:33pm] gordosupe: maybe they wont post it
[1:33pm] SCaNDaLs: i am sure apple still has the option to continue with PPC
[1:33pm] dorip: where's the video?
[1:33pm] SCaNDaLs: if they want to
[1:33pm] niteshado: scandal: or any other CPU - OS X is probably more mobile than any other mac OS :)
[1:34pm] SCaNDaLs: yep
[1:34pm] niteshado: again - what CPU is inside isn't important - provided it works well
[1:34pm] SCaNDaLs: my biggest worry is that devs will be too pissed off and want to abandon
[1:34pm] bitrot: guess they no wwdc 2005 video yet
[1:34pm] gordosupe: Im so pissed, I baught a 2.7 G5
[1:34pm] bitrot: guess they will have to really edit it
[1:34pm] gordosupe: maybe i'll sell it
[1:35pm] bilano: About 2 minutes after Steve announced the switch... wait until you hear these people...
[1:35pm] bilano: They are rowdy.
[1:35pm] niteshado: gordo: I have a dG5 2.0 on order - it's was due to arrive last week
[1:35pm] bitrot: xbox tripple core 3ghz
[1:35pm] bitrot: ppc
[1:35pm] bilano: It's like some kind of rituatlistic chant... the whole audience is making this sound, like some kind of tribal thing.
[1:35pm] bilano: I could feel the tension in the air.
[1:35pm] gordosupe: its such crap, by next year i'll be already outdated by new crap
[1:35pm] niteshado: gorod: do I pay..... do I screw over the reseller (who is a friend!) - I don't think :(
[1:35pm] gordosupe: yea
[1:35pm] gordosupe: im selling on ebay
[1:35pm] dorip1: actually
[1:35pm] gordosupe: iguess
[1:36pm] ceri: niteshado: "end of 2007" is 30 months away.
[1:36pm] SCaNDaLs: mention of apple on cnbc
[1:36pm] dorip1: computers are always outdated yearly
[1:36pm] dorip1: the platform and the processor inside matter little
[1:36pm] sirhenry left the chat room.
[1:36pm] gordosupe: we just got done with a major transition and they want another one???? I thought it was smooth sailing...
[1:36pm] dorip left the chat room. (Read error: Operation timed out)
[1:37pm] bilano: You can see the sweat beading up on Jobs about 4 minutes in.
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[1:37pm] SCaNDaLs: steve on G5: "this chip has legs"
[1:37pm] bilano: At about 6 and a half minutes, you can see it soak through his shirt.
[1:37pm] niteshado: gord: next year we would always be outdated - that doesn't worry me. What worries me is if an OS version after leopard is named "sabre tooth" as in intel only....
[1:37pm] gordosupe: true
[1:37pm] bilano: By ten minutes in, Steve is speaking only on pure will power... the will to not upset the shareholders.
[1:38pm] ceri: niteshado: Agreed. Even if they price dump on powerbooks, do I buy one?
[1:38pm] SCaNDaLs: do u need one?
[1:38pm] dorip1: let's see
[1:38pm] niteshado: gordo: apple always said that cocoa was the long term - and devs should transition to there - they also announced potential x86 compatibility of cocoa apps way back in the rhapsody days - ie it was always an option
[1:39pm] bitrot: the only good thing about it is that we get faster powerbooks
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[1:39pm] niteshado: ceri: price dumping is likely..... I'm about to pay full price :(((
[1:39pm] bitrot: beats wallowing in 1.33 ghz hell
[1:39pm] gordosupe: It really changes the essence of what mac is all about though
[1:39pm] ceri: SCaNDaLs: well, I need a laptop, but I'd like to know if I'll be able to use it for the next 3 years or no.
[1:39pm] SCaNDaLs: ceri: i am sure you will be fine
[1:39pm] SCaNDaLs: i just bought a dual 2.0
[1:39pm] SCaNDaLs: im not too worried
[1:39pm] bilano: Slashdot reports that someone has already ported OSX to work on commodity PCs.
[1:39pm] dorip1: some will think their macs are useless but will want to get lotsof money for them, while others will think macs are useless and know the value will drop, and others will think macs are still useful and take advantage of any price drop...and some will think that the prices should be the same, and so they won't sell or won't go down...until the market forces them
[1:39pm] ceri: SCaNDaLs: Oh, I'll survive ;)
[1:40pm] gordosupe: This has got to be a mess, having to recode and recompile apps and then make sure all operating systems are compatable
[1:40pm] niteshado: ceri: I woulda got an imac instead - and saved A$1000 ish
[1:40pm] niteshado: the woulda done me nicely for the next 3 years (vs 5 years for the PPC)
[1:40pm] bitrot: ive got a mac mini just 1 month ago. guess i will still have it after my powerbook is long gone
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[1:40pm] ceri: niteshado: I think I will wait another week for some clarity on the future.
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[1:40pm] dave-nyc: those that bough 1 or 2 g5 shouldn't worried - mid to large production houses...well, that may be a dif story
[1:40pm] traxxas_: wtf
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[1:41pm] SCaNDaLs: as long as they keep compiling for both
[1:41pm] gordosupe: how can an intel be faster if they are constantly flaming intel based computers
[1:41pm] niteshado: ceri: that is what I would be doing too - if I hadn't already ordered...
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[1:41pm] gordosupe: all of a sudden it works great for mac?
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[1:41pm] ceri: niteshado: Can't you cancel?
[1:41pm] niteshado: gordo: they may not be in the future - hence the change
[1:41pm] niteshado: ceri: I don't know....
[1:42pm] ^Nikon left the chat room. (^Nikon)
[1:42pm] gordosupe: why not AMD then?
[1:42pm] Luc_: I think that the point is HOW in the world can we EVER trust JOBS again??
[1:42pm] bilano: Christ! The fanboys are cannibalizing each other on the forums!
[1:42pm] ceri: niteshado: In .uk it would be a no-brainer.
[1:42pm] sciflyer: which forums?
[1:42pm] niteshado: gordo: probably got a sweeter deal from intel - and/or intel has a better plan
[1:42pm] bilano: They are attacking each other, eating their wounded.
[1:42pm] bilano: This is sick!
[1:42pm] ceri: gordosupe: yeah. Altivec, etc..
[1:43pm] niteshado: Luc: I don't see the big deal in switching per se - I don't think it's that big a deal at least on the surface of things
[1:43pm] gordosupe: im afraid mac wont be the same...
[1:43pm] ceri: slashdot has been slashdotted.
[1:43pm] niteshado: there are various technicalities tho...
[1:43pm] bilano: It would have been better if it were AMD.
[1:43pm] Luc_: I have over ten thousand dollars in Software and Hardware bought with Apple, that is a BIG DEAL!~
[1:43pm] bilano: Better chips, better tech.
[1:44pm] octa left the chat room. (Ping timeout: no data for 244 seconds)
[1:44pm] bilano: Luc_: As Steve would say, "tough titty!"
[1:44pm] gordosupe: AMD is far superior in power to intel
[1:44pm] Mob1us: it's all tit for tat
[1:44pm] niteshado: bilano: nothing says it can't won't be AMD - apple can play those suppliers against each other - the way they ?did with moto and IBM
[1:44pm] Luc_: Yes Steve is saying that and thats why I will NEver trust that fucker agian!
[1:44pm] gusto- joined the chat room.
[1:44pm] Mob1us: anyone can make a test the will prove or disprove whatever they ewant
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[1:44pm] bryce__: niteshado: right, in fact thats a big reason for this move. Because moto/freescale pretty much dropped out of the race, Apple is now locked into one PPC vendor... and thats a bad place to be
[1:45pm] bitrot: so it was a good desision to change, beats being deadended with ppc
[1:45pm] niteshado: personally I trust that steve weighed it up and determined that x86 was better for mac - and he's in a much better position to do so than me
[1:45pm] gordosupe: bilano: have any pics of the fiasco?
[1:45pm] dorip joined the chat room.
[1:45pm] gordosupe: I really want to see this and im guessing apple wont post the vid
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[1:46pm] niteshado: we could be thanking him in the future :)
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[1:46pm] niteshado: that's sad - if developers should such little foresight
[1:46pm] niteshado: and react like kids
[1:46pm] niteshado: should = show
[1:46pm] ceri: niteshado: We could be. I just hope they make it through the next two and a half years where nobody will want to buy a mac.
[1:46pm] bitrot: yeah pretty much\
[1:47pm] bitrot: sales will take a massive dump ithink
[1:47pm] niteshado: ceri: yeah - that means cheap macs - which hurts here
[1:47pm] gordosupe: so it HAS to be a intel mac and not a pc to run OS X?
[1:47pm] gordosupe: it will make it easier to port OS X to any old PC
[1:47pm] ceri: gordosupe: Not sure. Depends if you can only get 10.4.1 for Intel with the devkit or not.
[1:47pm] Mob1us: he mever said it would be a apple only thing
[1:47pm] niteshado: well 2 years + 1 year of v1.0 (= beta) releases = 3 years - I'd still get a 3 year mac now - eg an iMac
[1:48pm] gordosupe: b/c this means u can buy a dell and run mac
[1:48pm] Mob1us: i sold my imac 350
[1:48pm] ceri: niteshado: *you* would. Don't know if Joe Public would.
[1:48pm] Mob1us: was a picec of shit
[1:48pm] bitrot: i think the problems is that is destablises the ppc dev market.
[1:48pm] niteshado: moblus: yes - let's ask what was NOT said (that should have been said)
[1:48pm] bitrot: why spend money on ppc programs when they will be EOL in 24 months or less
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[1:48pm] bitrot: so we will NOT get new updates from big guys out there.
[1:48pm] Mob1us: i agree
[1:48pm] gordosupe: well, ill be rdy for an update in 3 years (transition complete) so it will work our fine
[1:49pm] Mob1us: it's always the parts they "leave out"
[1:49pm] SCaNDaLs: because people with existing ppc machines will buy those apps
[1:49pm] SCaNDaLs: people who buy new machines arent the only ones buying apps
[1:49pm] bitrot: i think apple will loose a lot of developers next 6 months.
[1:49pm] dorip left the chat room. (Read error: Operation timed out)
[1:49pm] bitrot: no incentive to dev until transition is over
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[1:50pm] niteshado: 1. will it run on non apple intel, 2. will windows run on an intel mac, 3. how long will Apple FULLY support PPC macs. 4. will OS 11 run on PPC, and 5. will x86 apps ever run "natively" under mac OS X on intel macs.
[1:50pm] sciflyer: why will apple lose devs?
[1:50pm] bitrot: 1. no 2. no 3. 3-5 years 4. whoknows 5. nope
[1:50pm] sciflyer: anyone who is a good dev devs for apple cause they like the APIS
[1:50pm] sciflyer: APIs are going nowhere
[1:51pm] gordosupe: why doesnt apple just declare its done making hardware and say you can go buy a dell and we will provide OS x?
[1:51pm] bitrot: too many unknows for hardware
[1:51pm] niteshado: 6. will we see frankenapps - ie wintel UI apps pushed over to OS X with chunky win UIs. 7. will companies produce one app for win - which then rus (poorly and ugly) on an intel mac OS X
[1:51pm] bitrot: control it all and it will work. we will get nice desktops/craptops with osx it will be ok in th end
[1:52pm] bitrot: it could be apple devotees stop buying apple stuff.
[1:52pm] niteshado: I'd like to see Apple answer Qs 1-5
[1:52pm] bitrot: killing apple
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[1:52pm] gordosupe: does this mean you can buy pc hardware / graphics cards / sound cards rather then mac version ones?
[1:53pm] IvIoyner: probably
[1:53pm] Mob1us: you already can usually
[1:53pm] Mob1us: most makers have apple drivers
[1:53pm] iviking left the chat room.
[1:53pm] Mob1us: and the basic architecture is pc - like already
[1:53pm] stomp left the chat room. (Leaving)
[1:54pm] niteshado: gordo: that will depend on what OS X drivers those makers supply (same as now) :)
[1:54pm] niteshado: moblus: yup - major difference is...er... was .... the CPU
[1:54pm] Mob1us: yup
[1:54pm] gordosupe: so mac is no longer unique in hardware?
[1:54pm] Mob1us: nope
[1:54pm] gusto- left the chat room. (gusto-)
[1:54pm] Mob1us: scsi, gone
[1:55pm] niteshado: on the inside - seemly not
[1:55pm] cwoodfiel: Mob1us: the Apple driver is usually on the card's BIOS, however...not a software driver
[1:55pm] Mob1us: ah didn't know
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[1:55pm] niteshado: moblus: heck mac OS gone too (the real mac OS was classic)
[1:55pm] cwoodfiel: or more specifically the PPC driver
[1:55pm] Mob1us: true
[1:56pm] niteshado: I guess with all the iPod money - apple can stay afloat until the finish the transition...
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[1:56pm] Mob1us: easily
[1:56pm] Mob1us: those things are 400% mark up
[1:56pm] niteshado: the business world is going to like the intel switch I reckon
[1:58pm] niteshado: so shares will probably go up (unless the dumbass business world realises what it's going to do to sales in the next 2 years (this will require them to look way more forward than they usually do.... ))
[2:00pm] gordosupe: how much faster will the new powermac running an intel be compared to a dual 2.7 G5 i wonder....
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